Mr. Rivlin came in to join a crew of craftsmen builders painters in the early nineties, a crew which I eventually joined and would work with through out the decade. My audio is low in this but the convo is still a good one. Here’s me and Phil catching up.Check out Phil’s artwork on instagram. https://www.instagram.com/p_as_in_phillip/Get a few extras on my Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/limitedperspectiveAlso the Limited Perspective website. https://limited-perspective.com/